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Structural Insulated Panels
(343 posts) (108 voices)-
Posted Friday 1 Oct 2010 @ 7:34:01 am from IP #
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it is about wind loads
Posted Friday 1 Oct 2010 @ 7:35:21 am from IP # -
amazing
Membernew to the site. thought i'd mention we have just built a new home using SIP's we found a company in Newcastle who manufacture wall and floor systems. absolutely brilliant! insulation is incredible and looks great the internal linings and external cladding are made from the same product and the finish is really really nice (built in weeks instead of months - heaps less trades involved too which I liked).
anyway, it is available in NewcastlePosted Thursday 4 Nov 2010 @ 10:15:06 am from IP # -
mel7
Memberamazing I would love to hear more about your project. We are in Tasmania, have owner built in the past with strawbales but are looking for a quicker alternative, from what I have read SIPS seem like a fantastic option. Can you please give us the name of the company who supplied your panels? did you clad your house or render over the panels and did you have to clad over the panels with plaster on the inside too? I would love to see some photos?
Posted Friday 5 Nov 2010 @ 8:27:49 am from IP # -
amazing
MemberHey mel7
the company name is Jonden Manufacturing they have a factory in a suburb called Weston near Newcastle in NSW 02 49374347.We didn't render or clad we used elastomeric paint by Wattyl sprayed textured 'render look' finish on the external walls (sealed and undercoat and topcoat system) and rollered paint finish to internal walls.... didn't even need a plasterer.
I'm sure the company will help you out with photos etc.
cheers
amazingPosted Tuesday 9 Nov 2010 @ 4:27:24 am from IP # -
Hi ,I am also new to the site .I work for a company that buys SIP's in Queensland to build houses and buildings in Pacific Islands .They are cyclone rated to 70 metres per second for these islands.
The building system is visible on the manufacturers website; ecohousing.com.au
The panels are Made of injected polyurthane with 6mm fibro sheeting on either side.
The Panels come in various thicknesses and are structural,fire resistant,termite resistant(no organic matter), we are actually on 2 projects that include 2 story buildings which apparantly have already been achieved on several occasions in Queensland.
The manufacturer also produces panels with only one side sheeted with fibro or colourbond which a designed for renovation projects such as wall cladding or roof restorations.
These panels are simply fixed to the existing walls or roofs .
The supplier already supplies all over Australia.cheers
JoshPosted Sunday 28 Nov 2010 @ 6:37:48 am from IP # -
moemoke
MemberWell I had a talk with the Aussie SIPS boss the other day but the news wasn't good.
Since I last spoke to him he has been to America for the SIPs association conference
where spoke to many manufacturer's and engineers. Before he went he was told that all
the panels have been approved by the authorities etc etc but once he was in the US the story was a bit different. They weren't approved and each house would have to be engineer designed which is not what he wanted. He spoke to the engineer that was hired by the SIPs assoc and even he said they wouldn't be passed as a general building material and if anyone wants to build with it then they will need to get individual engineer certification.
So Aussie Sips is no longer. and many years and thousands of dollars lost.Amazing, did you have to get your house engineer designed?
Posted Tuesday 30 Nov 2010 @ 10:28:11 am from IP # -
amazing
MemberHey moemoke
We took our house plans to the SIP company who gave us a price. We had engineering done to lodge our development application to council. It was pretty easy. I think the best idea is to have your plans drawn to suit the panel sizes rather than adapt your plans to the panels later (it is cheaper if they don't havee to cut panels etc). Oh yeah, the builder was pretty happy because they supplied EVERYTHING all the nuts and bolts and nails etc.ps: the America panels are alot different to what we have.
cheersPosted Friday 3 Dec 2010 @ 4:15:51 am from IP # -
ptd
MemberTry contacting R Control Australasia, in Wagga and currently building in a number of states. Fantastic panel, offering a completely sealed envelope.
You may like to view their website first.
http://www.au.rcontrol.comPosted Friday 3 Dec 2010 @ 10:53:19 am from IP # -
Posted Friday 3 Dec 2010 @ 1:02:30 pm from IP #
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Does anyone know if these panels can be inputed into Bers Pro or first rate when deciding on your house energy rating (nathers)?
Posted Wednesday 8 Dec 2010 @ 11:27:11 pm from IP # -
dubbo teacher
MemberCan't help you solar brisbane on your query but am interested in SIPs myself. Is it just me or are most of these SIP websites a bit dodgy?
pdf files bombing out and the most user unfriendly website designs I've seen eg rcontrol aussiesips etc etc.
I saw somewhere on this forum last year a reference to greenenergybricks and their website is at least informative and the product is just what I'm looking for, which is...
- excellent insulation
- exterior (on both sides) that is weatherproof and, at a pinch, requires no painting, rendering or waterproofing ie can be left completely as is
- is not going to weather or deteriorate over time
- does away with conventional frame
- allows NO thermal bridging
- can cater for a span of 9m without the need for inside loadbearing walls
- caters for services without chasing
- is structurally strong and longlasting
One major consideration is whether to go with panels per se (probably 2.4m standard width - but don't expect any website to tell you stuff in plain English)
OR whether to go with 'bricks' a la greenenergy bricks that are 600mm x 300mm (and I believe with any such bricks it is best to design door and window openings and, in fact, the whole house in multiples of that basic dimension - whatever it is.)My question here then is...has anybody built with/know somebody who has built with green energy-type bricks and/or panel SIPs for a NORMAL house - not mining huts, coolrooms, demountables, school buildings, farm sheds etc???
And if so would you do so again?
What are the pitfalls, if any?
Was it cost effective??***I know some people will think that an airtight envelope does not allow sufficent ventilation but surely that is a separate issue that needs to be addressed by judicious placement of windows/doors tailored to the micro-environment of each particular housesite?
Posted Friday 11 Feb 2011 @ 11:43:56 pm from IP # -
matas
MemberDT, these greenenergy foam bricks are very interesting.
I have not heard of them before.
Thanks for the information.
Just wondering, have you tried contacting the company ?
I am sure they would know of any domestic houses that use their product.
Apparently they can be DIY laid, which appeals to me.Posted Saturday 12 Feb 2011 @ 1:26:13 am from IP # -
dubbo teacher
MemberHello Matas
I looked at their website and like you was interested. Contacted them and 600mm - normal size bricks were $55 inc GST and $44 for half size - which you obviously need for corners and doors/windows - so on that basis the less openings the better although you wouldn't decide to do away with a window for that reason but perhaps people would decide to make windows larger and have less of them.
I definitely like the idea but know of personally of nobody who has built in this style (or any other SIP for that matter) - in a normal suburban house setting. But some member here will have built with them and/or have a friend who has.
The bottom line for me is that you are doing away with trades such as gyprockers/plasterers; brickies; carpenters; and materials associated with those trades and also bulk and reflective insulation in the walls.
The energy brick and SIPs in general probably cost more upfront but those savings should make them competitive and then we must consider, of course, the potential energy savings in heating and cooling.
I have not looked deeper into embodied energy implications and whole of life issues but are currently putting the final touches to my DA with this material front and centre.Posted Saturday 12 Feb 2011 @ 7:31:49 am from IP # -
Frateco
MemberI thought I'd have a look at the website because it stated R8+. You know, I can't find any technical information apart from a letter of recommendation by Dr Keith Garzoli - no thermal conductivity values, no data. Their detailed section refers to a Drawing No.8 for lintel sizes but can't find it. Drawing No.7 shows lintel profile which (I think) is for spans up to 3600mm but no engineering certificate to validate this. I have no idea what figure 2 on Drawing No.7 means for lintels over 3600mm span. They have a 180x35 top plate for truss tiedown - this needs to be checked by an engineer and just be aware that timber is either 170 or 190x35, not 180.
Call me picky but I'm not seeing professionalism here and would hate to see anyone stuffed around.
Posted Friday 18 Feb 2011 @ 2:10:05 am from IP # -
Buzzman
MemberNot exactly SIPs, but this guy on the Renovate forums has built a big extension and a shed out of ICF - concrete reinforced styrofoam.
He's also cladding the older brick veneer section of the original house with Masterwall EPS panels, and is a really good "how to" kind of guy.
It's a long thread but has some excellent tips adn links on all the products and tools needed for working with EPS and ICF.
http://www.renovateforum.com/f176/icf-extension-project-76617/
Posted Saturday 19 Feb 2011 @ 4:50:36 am from IP # -
dubbo teacher
MemberThanks Buzzman for the link to this bloke doing the reno. He doing a hellova job isn't he? Attention to detail and quality of work is first rate. In fact he reminds me a little of myself! - with just a few extra things he has going for him that I don't ...
1. Skill
2. Knowledge
3. Time
4. Money
5. Great equipmentPosted Tuesday 22 Feb 2011 @ 11:02:09 am from IP # -
dubbo teacher
MemberOH and a really nice mother-in-law...
Posted Tuesday 22 Feb 2011 @ 11:02:59 am from IP # -
Buzzman
MemberFrom the looks of his reno I reckon if you can remember how to use kiddies wooden blocks you should be able to cope with EPS blocks and a glue gun.
I like the stuff he'd bought form the States too, lots of useful gear on that US website.
But, yes, as you say, mother in law.......
And an understanding and well-paid wife!!!
One of them I could definitely relate too!!! LOL!!!
Posted Tuesday 22 Feb 2011 @ 11:49:49 pm from IP # -
Sorry for the extra long post, had lots going on recently.
So my saga to find a suitable building material continues. I went through a significant process with R-Control but the organisation is still very immature in this country with poor engineering support. They also were unsure as to whether they could get their fire rated panels. Basically I would avoid them until they finally get their factory going in Wagga and have had time to settle down.
I have since started talking to the company that was Jonden but is now Paneco (http://www.paneco.com.au). The website is a bit sparse at the moment (only a few weeks old) but they have fair numbers of houses built already. Fancy that, completing product development and building a few houses *before* getting your website up!
A few notes on the product:
- Product is a SIP of MgO cement sheets and EPS foam. Comes in a few thicknesses for both internal and external walls.
- Cement sheet thickness is 12mm for exterior skin and 6mm for interior skins.
- Suitable for both external walls and internal.
- Pre-chased for plumbing and electrics. Additional chases possible on site using the "red hot plumbob" technique.
- Surface finish of product is smooth enough that it can just have the edges jointed and then painted. That is to say, while more embodied energy than OSB type SIP, you save on gypsum and whatever external finishes you were going to use.
- Excellent fire rating, easily god enough for bushfire area.
- Can be used for walls, floor and roofs.
- The standard 110mm wide exterior panel is just over R3 and of course air infiltration will be as good as your window and roof-wall joining.
- Recently managed to get a reasonably price 3 bedroom house a 10 star rating in Qld without any fancy addons like solar panels.
- The sales guy at my builder is using their product to build a tri-level house here in Melbourne and has an 8 star rating.
- Seems to be very good value, panels are by no means expensive and are very quick to put up.
- If you suddenly decided to have more doors or windows on-site, you can simply use a demo saw to cut the panel, hot wire out some foam and line the hold with timber and you are ready to go.
Richard
Posted Friday 25 Mar 2011 @ 12:07:23 am from IP # -
prettygully
MemberThanks for this info Richard; I am trying to decide on what to build the new -- well insulated -- house from as well, and am seriously considering SIPs!
Seems like you managed too obtain more info from paneco than I did; did you actually get any details on pricing? would love to hear about any further developments if you happen to pursue this!!
Amazing - you seemed to have built with this material: how long ago & how's the house holding up? what to watch out for - and would you build again with the same material or do something different ????
cheers
karinPosted Monday 28 Mar 2011 @ 2:47:23 am from IP # -
Andy M
MemberHello all,
We are currently designing a two storey house to be built in the Freo area of Perth. It is going to be built out of SIPS panels if possible. Next week I am going to meet the SIPS manufacturers in Perth (www.sips.com.au) that have a manufacturing facility in Bibra Lake. They build SIPS panels out of OSB and engineered foam. I want them to replace the OSB with concrete fibre board externally and internally. I will post the outcome of our meeting in two weeks.
Posted Thursday 21 Apr 2011 @ 9:43:06 am from IP # -
Andy M
MemberSorry, posted the wrong website. It is http://www.sipsindustries.com.au. To preempt any possible questions I have no affiliation with the company or product at all. We are simply attempting to build a house efficiently and within a budget (concepts I am learning the building industry is not familiar with) but to a high spec both environmentally and aesthetically (I hope the spelling is correct).
Posted Thursday 21 Apr 2011 @ 9:47:29 am from IP # -
chevymonstar
MemberI notice a lot of talk by ptd about R Control. This company seems to not really exist in Australia. I have personally made a number of calls to them with no success. They have 1 rep in Australia who never returns calls. I have personally spoken face to face with a rep from Green Haus at the Seymour sustainability show this year, and when we attempted to follow up got no response (they have not actualy built anything yet). I then tried Kingspan, whom we spoke with at the HIA show last year. They do not have a plant in Australia, don't know when they will have and won't import they're own product!
The only people who seem to be doing anything are SIPS Industries, but they only really work in WA. We have even gone to extent of talking with Canadian manufacturers who are happy to ship here, but we don't know if the product meets Aust regs.
Europe has been using this technology to build for 30+ years and even the USA for the last 10-15. We are ready to build and very, very frustrated.
Finally we may have found someone willing to build using steel sips, who manufactures here!!!!!! Good luck anyone wanting to uild with SIPS cause someone is against us!!!!!
Posted Tuesday 3 May 2011 @ 6:10:15 am from IP # -
emmbee
MemberHey Andy,
I'm looking into using SIPs for a house in Karrinyup. Am at the very beginning of sourcing all the info and comparing it against double brick - I recently discussed with solar compass homes the cost comparison between the two as they are looking into using SIPs for their project homes. So far it's looking like SIPs and double brick come out fairly comparative... with SIPs being more expensive upfront in some cases but deliverying a quicker build time (approx. half the time of double brick).
Look forward to your post about the outcomes of your meeting.
Posted Tuesday 3 May 2011 @ 2:35:39 pm from IP # -
ptd
MemberThere are three R Control homes in Albany, one of which is mine. My daughter lives in Canberra and there ARE a number of SIPs home that have been built, with R Control building them, and others that are currently being built there too. The building of my SIP home was not difficult at all. It is double storey, and SIPs were used for the floor, walls and roof, providing a tight envelope for the frame. The speed of erection, long term energy savings, clean air, and general sustainable attributes made it my choice.
Posted Thursday 5 May 2011 @ 2:16:04 pm from IP # -
NovelTech
MemberHi Richard/All, Can anyone provide more specific info on pricing? I am interested in knowing how the cost of locally vailable SIPs stacks up against conventional building methods i.e. what is the $/m2 cost for SIPs versus conventional building wall materials (excluding construction costs), and the $/m2 cost for installed SIP walls versus conventional walls?
Posted Thursday 5 May 2011 @ 11:21:39 pm from IP # -
NovelTech
MemberHi,
No answers on my cost question. However I found an interesting cost comparison on the zego website which shows brick veneer at $111/m2, double brick at $169/m2 and concrete block at $149/m2.It shows the Zego wall at $116/m2. Can anyone confirm based on their expereince that the cost estimates for conventional building methods look sound?
Posted Monday 16 May 2011 @ 7:28:53 am from IP #
